Posts by joey jojo

86

New light on shunning?

by Mikejw in

one theory why tony was booted out was because he was a stickler for not changing the shunning doctrine.

he actually said the words we will never ever change it.. they are slowly deleting all of tony’s videos and now losing court cases and losing government hand outs in places like norway.. it’s looking very likely they will release new light on shunning policy after losing this latest one in norway.. .

what are the odds they coincidentally get new light from jehovah and lighten up their shunning policy ?.

joey jojo

If my family hadnt spoken to me for years and then suddenly contacted me because they were told it was ok, I would tell them to go f%^K themselves.

Family is over-rated.

10

Finding Neverland

by Freeorange in

add bookmark.

#1. i have to start off this post by saying i am not intending to insult or offend.

these are just our observations over our entire lives in the org.

joey jojo

This post resonates with my experience in the Borg.

Except for the Ferrari's in the kingdom Hall carpark.

And the new age jw songs, which I'm glad I missed.

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/36782/dating-conspiracy-exposed

This is another thread claiming 511 is the right date. Is this jwposter under an another name?

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

Scholar:
Utter nonsense. The clay tablet notwithstanding its provenance is open to interpretation and to translation. There are at least four translations in English from the original German article and this tablet has been rigorously examined by Dr Rolf Furuli who is an expert in the Akkadian language
using several different astro programs concluded that Neb's 37th year was in 588 BCE rather than the widely accepted date of 568 BCE which of course validates 607 BCE as the only possible date for the Fall of Jerusalem.
Jeffro on his blogs simply provides his interpretation of the astronomical data in the tablet and there is another website that also provides an alternative interpretation -www. VAT 4956. com
Yes, this tablet could be a 'smoking gun' in that it affirms 607 BCE rather than the controversial 587 or 586 BCE for the Fall but the 'jury is out' on this matter.

One of my hobbies is amateur astronomy. I have been interested in it for 40 years. Does that make me a world expert on anything? No. But I am fairly confident in this area and sometimes the simplest answer is the right answer.

There is a reason the WT over-complicates this subject. Read the 2 part article they wrote about the fall of jerusalem and you will see what I mean. It is designed to make the average person feel that it is a subject that is difficult to understand and its better just to trust that the org has done its research and 607 is right, therefore 1914 is right.

Forget about lunar eclipses, retrograde motions of planets, full moons in slightly wrong positions. It is all white noise to distract from the obvious. The planet Saturn was in a particular part of the sky in a certain year. It doesnt even matter if it was a little bit in front- or behind. That wont make a difference for the purpose of dating the year. That only happens once every 29.4 years. Its a basic concept and its freely available for anyone to observe. All you have to do is go outside at night and look up. (Except for right now because Saturn is behind the Sun :) )

The rest of the planetary observations, which are all accurate, are just extra nails in the coffin of the 607 date. The reason its great that Saturn was visible that year is that it is the best planet to use for dating a certain year because of its slow movement through the zodiac.

Sorry, I said that VAT 4956 casually dismantles 607. I should have said it 'effortlessly' dismantles it.

As for the website vat4956.com, it agrees with the software I am using. Saturn is in the same positon, slightly behind the swallow (Pisces). When it first became visible, in the morning, earlier in the year it was lined up with Pisces. Here is vat4956.com:

Here is Sky View Cafe- I have marked the date, the position of Saturn and the co-ordinates of ancient Babylon:

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

Though it helps to supply us with the date for the Exile, it is pretty much an boring piece of rock that nobody but Jehovah's Witnesses worry about these days.

Yes, but it is a smoking gun that casually disassembles the whole 607 - 1914 doctrine of the WT. The deceit they employ to try to discredit vat4956 is shameful.

In their article - When was Jerusalem destroyed? (2011), they mention planets but do not cite what the tablets say about them, choosing to focus on the moon eclipses, which are prone to error and mis-interpretation.

Using a program like Sky View Cafe , anyone can see for themselves what the unidentified Babylonian observer saw in the night sky in the year 567 BCE.

https://skyviewcafe.com/

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

The direction a planet is moving (prograde or retrograde) is really not significant when discussing this subject. Their position at a certain time - like a snapshot is far more important.

Knowing Mercury's position is enough- it doesnt matter which direction its going in the night sky.

Whether the exact position of Saturn was a bit in front, or a bit behind the swallow is also unimportant. The fact that it is close is enough. It is only in that part of the sky once every 29.4 years.

In 588 , Saturn wasnt anywhere near the swallow. This stuff is not hard to understand.

JW's seem to be the only group determined to question the credibility and squeeze out answers from VAT 4956 that just arent there.

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

Luckily for us, Saturn was visible in the night sky when the observations were taken. If the position of Saturn is verified for 567, relative to a constellation, it will be 29.4 years before it is back in the same place. That means that Saturn couldn't have been anywhere near the same place 20 years previously in 588. This evidence alone is really all we need.

Trying to prove years based on eclipses is nothing more than a biased attempt to obfuscate and misdirect.

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

This topic has been discussed here a lot. The great thing about the astronomical observations on the tablet is that they dont have to be perfect to be accurate.

Conjuctions of planets in approximate relative positions to each other and to constellations are enough to establish a year. Simliar conjuctions may be hundreds or thousands of years apart. Anyone, or organisation like the wt, that emphasises eclipses, in relation to this topic, is purposely ignoring the superior evidence of planetary conjunctions.

Ive read apologists arguing over the position of a planet to a degree or 2 and missing the entire point. The observer is describing celestial positions by holding out his arm and counting finger-breadths, its never going to be 100% accurate- but it doesnt need to be.

271

VAT4956 - 530 BC destruction of Jerusalem by Nebuchadnezzar

by jwposter in

in my studies, i have concluded that year 530 bc was when the destruction of jerusalem occurred and the temple destroyed.

i had determined this prior to investigation of vat4956.

i had already found that the jubilees, sabbaticals, courses of the priests, and chronology attested to this.

joey jojo

In my astronomy program however, it doesn't have a year zero, so I researched year 511 BC. And seen enough to know that it was a match to the Tablet VAT4956.

I would be really interested to know exactly what you believe matched VAT4956 in 511 BC. Because the planets definitely would not have matched.

47

The First Holocaust

by nicolaou in

please, please ignore all the scientific impossibilities here, that's not what this topic is about.. let's make the assumption as many christians do that the bible is historically accurate.

the noachian flood actually happened a little less than 4,500 years ago after which eight adults stepped off the ark to repopulate the planet.. that means that approximately 60 million lives had been snuffed out, a holocaust by anyone's estimation.

as if that isn't horrific enough just think about the babies, toddlers and young children god killed.. he drowned all of them, every single one.

joey jojo

KalebOutWest
Our culture is impotant to us. The music, food, dress, languages, holidays and myths and just some of the ways we celebrate our identity as a people.
It isn't slavery to celebrate your culture.

I understand there are a lot of jews that dont necessarily believe in god and yet are still proudly jewish and may follow some customs or none at all. However, around 90% of jews are circumcised. Why is that? Is that not a direct result of a commandment from god that is expected to be followed by every jewish family? I would argue that it is a religious ritual that has enslaved generations.

From what I understand, the passover and festival of tabernacles may have been observed before the torah as harvest festivals. Harvest festivals were universally celebrated among early humanity and are not unique to the jewish culture.

What I am referring to by 'enslaved' is any ritual with a religious origin that obligates a person to do a certain thing at a certain time. If the torah is 'mainly illustrative', then why bother with any of it? If its culture and tradition that dictates these observances, where did that tradition start? Most traditions observed by modern jews seem to have religious beginnings and are therefore commands, not lifestyle choices.

What Im trying to say is that if god doesnt exist to many jews, or may exist, why follow any jewish rituals if most of them originate with the torah and are religious commands given by god - who many jews dont believe is real?